The fine folks at Sirius, who make our lives a lot easier by sending out transcribed portions of certain key interviews from the indispensable (except when they take calls from various assorted rambling yayhoos) NFL Radio channel, have provided us with a portion of John Madden’s comments regarding Raiders owner Al Davis and his Tuesday press conference.
Madden, who coached the Raiders for ten years and who was presented for enshrinement in Canton by Al Davis, recently spoke with Adam Schein of The Sirius Blitz.
“Well, it was one of those things that you could just see coming,” Madden said of the Lane Kiffin firing. “The Raiders weren’t winning and, of course, when that happens that kind of talk of the coach getting fired is always going to be there. I think this thing started over a year ago where Al Davis and Lane Kiffin didn’t get along. You didn’t know exactly when the end was going to come but you were pretty sure it was just right around the corner. I’ve felt that since the end of last season.”
Madden was later asked what he would tell a coach who might be working for Al Davis in the future. ”Just communicate with him,” Madden said. “I think that’s the thing. For some reason barriers have been built between the coaches and Al Davis. It was a totally different story when I was there, Adam. When I was there we just had five or six coaches and Ron Wolf was in the personnel department and Al Davis. So there were really less than ten of us and there were no barriers. I mean, everyone was right there together [and] we kind of did everything so we didn’t have any of these problems. And then as the game grew and the organization grew and you have more and more people and more and more assistants, I think instead of being closer and being part of each other, it looks to me like they just grew apart. And this is a situation that came to a head and Al Davis had to do something.
“People say, ‘Why did he have that press conference and why did he go through everything?’ I think that he just heard so many things that he wanted to just straighten them out. And it was one of things, he was going to be damned if he did and damned if he didn’t. If he didn’t have a press conference they were going to say, ‘Why didn’t you come out? Why didn’t you talk to the media? Why didn’t you show yourself?’ And then if he does [have a press conference], ‘Why do you have to air all of your laundry in public?’ In that situation there was probably no right way to do it and if you want to criticize him and the Raiders, then either way that he chose he’s going to be criticized anyway.”
As to the press conference, Madden had two observations. “One, he was making a coaching change and that announcement and that was one part of it,” Madden said. “And then I think all the things that he’s been living with the last maybe six months and hearing and not reacting to, he reacted to. That’s what I think. So I think it was a double agenda. One, a coaching change and, one, let’s get some things straight that have been said the last six months that I’ve been completely quiet about.”
Finally, Madden addressed whether the situation in Oakland can be repaired. “I think it is fixable,” Madden said. “Anytime you have an organization and an owner that wants to win as badly as Al Davis wants to win, and will spend the money to win, I don’t think you have as many barriers as you think. Those are easy. The ones that would be tough is where you didn’t have any good players and you had an owner or an organization that didn’t want to spend any money to get good players.”
Though some commenters think that our reaction to the Davis press conference means that we’re projecting the Raiders to win three of the next Super Bowls, we think that Davis and company have a real challenge on their hands. Frankly, Davis seems to be searching for another John Madden in an era where even John Madden wouldn’t have stayed John Madden for long.
The game has changed dramatically. Al Davis hasn’t changed at all. In 2008, most NFL coaches who have positioned themselves for success are reluctant to defer to the owner when it comes to matters relating to football, and NFL coaches refuse to coach the team any way other than their way.
And so Davis is looking for guys like Lane Kiffin and Tom Cable, men who haven’t landed on the “A” list and thus who don’t behave like “A” list coaches. Today, “A” list coaches want to buy the groceries; in Oakland, the coach is merely the chef in a pre-stocked kitchen. With the owner of the restaurant telling him how many times to stir the stew.
In Madden’s day, few if any NFL coaches had the power and influence that many now possess. And so the biggest flaw in the Raiders’ approach to running an NFL team in the 21st Century is the failure of Al Davis to recognize that, even if he cracks open enough oysters named Kiffin or Cable and finds the next Madden, the next Madden will quickly realize that there are plenty of other places where he can coach a football team the way he wants to do it, not the way Al Davis wants it to be done.
Especially when some college programs, where the head coach has been the king for a long time, are now paying as much or more money than Davis has been willing to pay his own head coaches.
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October 2nd, 2008 at 9:31 am
Boom! Whap! More Turducken!
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Rating: 2 / 5 with 4 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:36 am
Wow. Does Madden still get a paycheck from Davis? Because it sure as hell sounds like it.
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Rating: 2.3 / 5 with 10 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:40 am
The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results. By that definition, Al Davis is insane. Davis needs to get a real coach, and then let them coach. A good coach, able to choose his own staff and having control over personnel decisions, could turn the Raiders around. Hiring a coach and tying his hands behind his back clearly does not work, but apparently Davis is the only one who fails to see that.
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Rating: 3.8 / 5 with 11 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:42 am
I did not expect Madden to blast the Raiders and he did not. He did say things have changed dramatically since he was there. He said communication between Al and the HC is the foundation. I get the impression that Al is not available most of the time to anyone except his inner circle.
Florio you mentioned being the head chef in a well stocked kitchen. How about being the Head Cook at a McDonalds as a comparison - the head cook does not get to pick the food or the staff, they are told when to come to work and when to go home. At least a Chef gets to fire an assistant and toss food that is not good and will get to have input on new assistants. At McDonalds the Head Cook has no control over anything, just like being “head” coach for the Raiders.
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Rating: 4 / 5 with 12 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:45 am
I really think Davis should take a long look at Brian Billick. I think he had a good run in Baltimore, and I think some of his message was lost, and a new situation would be good for him.
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Rating: 2.6 / 5 with 5 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:46 am
God will step down from his throne and hand it to Madden when that day comes.
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Rating: 1.65 / 5 with 8 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:47 am
the next “madden”? what is that , a loud mouthed fat,overrated headcoach (tom flores HAS more rings than madden and took less years to do it) who is even more overrated as a loudmouthed fat announcer. WOW john madden defends al davis, didn’t see that coming.
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Rating: 2.35 / 5 with 12 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:55 am
That might have been your first good take on the Raiders situation…
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Rating: 4 / 5 with 8 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 9:58 am
Uhm, Madden… Al Davis could have had a press conference without vehemently bashing and belittling Lane Kiffin and whoever else he bashed, included but not limited to Chris Mortenson, Mike Shanahan, Bill Belichick, so on and so forth. It’s a thing called “class”. He could have announced the coaching change and the firing in a much, much classier way.
I’m stumped as to why Florio is so impressed with Al Davis… with his “clarity” or whatever. The guy was out of touch and belligerent.
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Rating: 3.8 / 5 with 16 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:00 am
John Madden has proven time and again that he is a total idiot. IMHO this is only further proof. Al Davis is a control freak who seems to have no idea how to treat people. His best days are far behind him.
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Rating: 3 / 5 with 8 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:04 am
Florio,
Again, nice work on the DP show this morning. What’s with your man-love to Al Davis? The old man is a side-show.
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Rating: 2.4 / 5 with 7 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:06 am
Oh if Carol backs his buddy he’s a hero… But Madden… who actually won a super bowl… unlike Carol…. Madden calls it straight… then he is delusional??????? How can opinions like those not be biased????
Haters… just admit it.
How is your team doing?
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Rating: 2.15 / 5 with 8 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:07 am
Madden is personally responsible for my all-time favorite rhyme. Two Thanksgivings ago, after an adult beverage (or
I dropped an F-bomb followed by “Turducken”. It was the kind of moment tha is made possible only through the perfect blend of football, turkey, tryptophan and beer. We still reflect fondly on that day and we still giggle two years later when we say it out loud…try it: f_ckin’ Turducken. HEHEHE.
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Rating: 2.35 / 5 with 3 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:10 am
“When I was there we just had five or six coaches and Ron Wolf was in the personnel department and Al Davis. So there were really less than ten of us and there were no barriers. I mean, everyone was right there together [and] we kind of did everything so we didn’t have any of these problems. And then as the game grew and the organization grew and you have more and more people and more and more assistants, I think instead of being closer and being part of each other, it looks to me like they just grew apart. And this is a situation that came to a head and Al Davis had to do something.”
Isn’t it Al Davis’ job to make sure the front office is cohesive? Isn’t it his job to be the owner, the leader, that makes sure his subordinates all communicate? You know, as opposed to cleaning his shoes?
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Rating: 4.1 / 5 with 9 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:11 am
who in their right mind would want to work for this deranged senile old man!?!
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Rating: 4.1 / 5 with 9 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:14 am
Mr. Florio,
During Al Davis’s new conference, he mentioned having 26/28 assistant coaches on the team. Madden might have a point with what he shared, with the layers upon layers of “managers”.
In any billion dollar company, IBM/Oracle/Yellow Trans. etc. it is very difficult to get to the “top” guy/gal to assist with any concerns or change recommendations. That being said, it seems as though that Mr. Davis doesn’t have many layers of managers (outside of asst. coaches) Directors, VPs, Sr. VPs, level people blocking his access or creating firewalls for access.
He alone can be responsible for a breakdown of communication, if he doesn’t have an open door policy. However, maybe he does and the HC just doesn’t feel they need to go to him with the many asst. coaches walking around.
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Rating: 3 / 5 with 4 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:15 am
Al Davis needs to step away. Unfortunately he will not be able to…until he is in the grave.
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Rating: 3.85 / 5 with 7 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:17 am
This just goes to show how much of a loon Al Davis really is. If he wants to have control over player selection (and coaches if you look at Rob Ryan) then he has to also quit blaming the coaches when the losses pile up. It seems to me if anyone the coach of a team should know what type of players fit into their system. The way it works in Raiderland though… the coach has their system or round holes and although some players might fit Davis has also dictated that the coach must jam in the square, rectangle and triangle pieces.
It is also lunacy that Davis wants to shine a negative light on Kiffin for some of the personnel moves. Moss was done with the Raiders. He served as a big distraction just like Jerry Porter. If Davis thought he could still use said player(s) it shows how out of touch with reality he really is. All Davis has really done since the days of Gruden was create a highly unstable situation. A me first situation where team is a dirty word. Why would you even bother playing as a team when you know the almost yearly coaching carousel is making its rounds and really you just need to catch the eye of the incoming coach. Also, why would you bend to the will of the coach and their program when you know you most likely will be outlasting said coach. I firmly believe you need a good three to four years to properly implement a system and to get the players to buy into the system. Unfortunately for Raider fans they will continue to witness a commitment to losing as long as the long shadow of Al Davis looms over their heads.
Do I believe he can turn it around? Yes. However, it will take Davis checking his ego at the door for it to happen. He has to realize that a few losing seasons with some stability may be necessary to get back to their winning ways. Until that happens expect to finish near the bottom of the division year in and year out. Sure, you can point to some of the rookie head coaches and their success this year as proof that a quick turn around is possible but those situations are different. Those situations do not up and fire coaches nor undermine them on a consistent basis.
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Rating: 3.9 / 5 with 11 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:19 am
The legs on this story are giving out.
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Rating: 4.2 / 5 with 5 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:26 am
I still think Florio is having some fun with us on the “impressed with Al” stance. If anything, it’s driving a lot of WTF comments, and in return, generating advertisement revenue for him.
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Rating: 4.2 / 5 with 5 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:26 am
Madden-”The key to the Raiders becoming more successful is to win more games. Its really hard to be a success in the National Football League without winning games. And the way we always won games was to score more touchdowns than the other team. That’s really needs to be the game plan for the Raiders: score touchdowns and win games. Success will soon follow. BOOM! Tough actin’ Tinactin!”
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Rating: 3.85 / 5 with 7 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:29 am
I am shocked at how negative the comments still are about Davis and about how surprised everyone is about Florio’s reaction.
It is obvious very few managers comment on this site (I am not one either by the way). But what I am is a 38 year old who has had a fair amount of “free reign” about how I’ve done my job over the years (as an engineer). And I also remember being a bull-headed 32 year old who reacted rather beligerantly, and with few people skills, when I perceived someone to be telling “how” to do my job because I secretly thougt I knew everything (only 20-somethings ACT like they know everything, 30-somethings are “smart” enough to try to keep it to themselves). I had this reaction even when I was making mistakes and knew I was making mistakes.
So even if you allow for the fact that Davis has also been bull-headed and has made mistakes you could argue that he has earned the right, given his track record over the years, to act that way. Now take is from Davis’ perspective, this young guy comes in and becomes kind of defensive when the team loses. So he suggests changes but does it in a less than tactful way, and Davis perceives that this means he’s trying to cover his ass more than find a way to win. Davis tries to be patient, but Kiffin (who has more balls than I ever had) decides he’s had enough or is too dense to back off and just keeps pushing things farther and farther. So Davis finally gets fed up and vents the reaction he’s been, rather admirably I might add, holding back until now at “The Press Conference” to end all press conferences. I can also understand hot wanting to pay the remainder of the contract. It’s about principle, not the money. Would you want to pay an ungrateful little upstart who’s been acting like a complete tool another 3.5 mil? Right or wrong this is the position Davis perceives himself to be in.
I think Madden and Florio are exactly right. The communication is just lacking. Modern coaches don’t have the mindset or the respect for Davis to legitimately consult with Davis about personnel and operations and Davis can’t stand it. I’m not saying it’s right I just understand Davis’ position now.
I’ve been one of the biggest Davis bashers out there, but now I completely agree with Florio’s take on the situation.
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Rating: 3 / 5 with 7 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:30 am
“some commenters think that our reaction to the Davis press conference
means that we’re projecting the Raiders to win three of the next Super Bowls…”
niiiiiiiiice straw man argument there!
No, actually some of us were saying that it was ridiculous for people
who are supposed to know something about the NFL, to make dumbass
statements like:
Al was supposedly “…stunningly candid…”
“…we tend to believe every word he’s saying…”
“…we get the sense that he treats his people well…”
(see: ‘Marcus Allen,’ etc.)
and “Davis deserves our deference and respect, and we’re more than happy to give it to him.”
and, predictably enough, Florio has already had to eat crow as he realizes that
Evil Al had baselessly called “…ESPN’s Chris Mortensen a ‘professional liar.’”
Mike Florio: The solid judgement of Sarah Palin, but without the looks.
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Rating: 3.85 / 5 with 7 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:32 am
Wow. A lot of people are down on Al Davis. For all the ineptitude he apparently has, he has helped build a team with enough talent good enough to be 3-1 right now. Unfortunately they goat-roped two of those victories away and sit at 1-3.
Maybe Davis saw it that way too and chose to fire his coach. Madden correctly characterized the presser as having two purposes. The part where he replaced his coach, and the part about dumping out six months of trashy details all over the table for us all to see.
While I could see him firing Kiffin or even giving him more time, I don’t have a problem with the firing itself.
The dirt that followed, as entertaining as it was, didn’t really need to be presented. I hope this wasn’t all done just because he’s too cheap to pay off the remaining contract. The man’s worth millions, you’d think it would be worth a few of them just to let this mess go quietly away. But then we all know “quietly” isn’t really Davis’ style is it?
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Rating: 2.8 / 5 with 5 rating(s)
October 2nd, 2008 at 10:33 am
That’s not a chef. That’s a cook.
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Rating: 5 / 5 with 2 rating(s)