In response to the news that Kentucky quarterback Andre Woodson was under the mistaken impression that he’d be drafted in the second round of last month’s draft, one league source is pointing the blame directly at Todd McShay and other wannabe scouts who don’t know as much as they think they know about what teams will do.
We tried to search ESPN.com for McShay’s 2008 mock drafts. His final 2008 mock draft now comes up as “null.” The Scouts Inc. final mock, prepared by McShay and two others, is still alive.
In that mock draft, McShay and company had Woodson going in round three to the Bears. Instead, Woodson was selected in round six by the New York Giants.
The following is an opinion that was passed along to us by the source, based on McShay’s assessment of Woodson.
“The problem with people like McShay is that they have no accountability,” the source said. “They can say what they want and when they are wrong no one cares, [except] the kid’s family. McShay could not get a job with any NFL team, even as an intern. He is a very poor evaluator. He proved it with his evaluation of Woodson.
“Woodson’s problem, and most everyone in the league saw it, was he has a very slow release and he stares down his receivers. In our league, he would get a very high percentage of interceptions because of his flaws. His accuracy is very average at best, so you put a slow release, not good accuracy, and stares down receivers and you get a guy who can’t play quarterback in the NFL.
“The networks should hire real scouts not wannabes like McShay. The other kid at ESPN, Jeremy Green, was fired after a couple of years with a club because he couldn’t evaluate, yet he is an “expert” with ESPN. These guys make more than twice as much money as real scouts and they don’t have a clue. ESPN should grade what these guys say and fire them when they are wrong a lot more often than when they are right.”
Moving forward, we’ll be keeping a close eye on what McShay has to say, especially since he seems to be the “hair” apparent to Mel Kiper. And, apparently, we’ll need to print off all of McShay’s mock drafts, since after the fact they can’t be found in a medium that ordinarily is premised on saving stuff, not deleting it.
In saying this, we full acknowledge the fact that we offer up our own periodic mock drafts in the weeks leading up to the draft. But ours isn’t based on our own scouting assessment of the players; we do it based on the things we hear from folks in the know. Even then, our mock draft often is a complete mess, too.
It would be even more of a mess if we pretended to be scouts.
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May 13th, 2008 at 10:35 am
This is typical ESPN. That network is the ultimate in “style over substance”. Their analysts, scouts and personalities are clowns that can’t get a real gig on a reputable network. NFL Network is running laps around ESPN; even “Path to the Draft” scrubs like Charles Davis are better than McShay and Kiper combined. Here’s to hoping someone takes over ESPN and actually makes it a sports network again…
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May 13th, 2008 at 10:43 am
On January 16th, PFT gives us a list of college players and agents that they have signed with. Certainly, Todd McShay’s Mock Draft occured after Woodson had already hired his agent.
http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/01/16/2008-players-and-agents-list/
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May 13th, 2008 at 10:46 am
“The problem with people like McShay is that they have no accountability”
That pretty much sums up the entire media as a profession!
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May 13th, 2008 at 10:53 am
I’d have to agree with Robby Redskin (aside from saying Charles Davis is decent). ESPN is quickly becoming the MTV of sports networks. All we need are a couple more reality shows.
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May 13th, 2008 at 10:57 am
First of all, I agree with those who say Woodson has only himself to blame if he based his opinion on any “expert”.
Even though these pre-draft opinions aren’t taken seriously by most people, they get a lot of press coverage running up to and during the draft, and in that sense, you’d expect that the experts ought to get some kind of grade.
It wouldn’t be that hard to come up with a system to grade each expert, and there’d be no harm in comparing one expert to another. If few people take “expert” picks seriously in the first place, even fewer would take their ranking seriously, and it would give people who like to discuss these things (like me) even more to talk about during the offseason.
Sure, in some sense it may not be fair to penalize an expert if a team reaches for a player. Think of Maurice Clarett — most experts had him as a late second day pick, but the Broncos took a chance on him with a third-round pick, and it didn’t work out. So, the Broncos were wrong (and they admit this), but it would penalize the expert’s grade. But, if you’re grading all of the experts against each other, and they all were in agreement as to where Clarett should have gone, then they’d all get dinged evenly.
It wouldn’t be perfect, but it could easily be done.
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May 13th, 2008 at 11:05 am
This is comical. Come on now, Florio! You know I love ya but it is beyond absurd to blast a guy for not being correct about his evaluation regarding certain prospects. McShay is not a mind reader, you know. This source sounds extremely bitter.
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May 13th, 2008 at 11:16 am
I agree with the comments defending McShay. Two words: Priest Holmes. Should every scout in the league be fired, because he wasn’t drafted? And the point is moot anyhow. We don’t know what type of career Woodson will have in the league. Get back to us in three years.
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May 13th, 2008 at 11:41 am
They are just guessing. What is the big deal? I thought he was a second round value pick going in, but he still may be the best QB in the draft. Tom Brady was not as good in college as he was.
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May 13th, 2008 at 11:52 am
This is absolutely absurd. Woodson thought he would go in the second round because of Todd McShay. Florio you are really reaching in order to bash another Giant. If you checked out most mock drafts Woodson went in rounds 2-4. I can’t believe you are wasting time writing two articles about a 6th round draft pick.
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May 13th, 2008 at 12:13 pm
It seems some misinformation has found its way into the comments. Woodson entered the draft as a senior to begin with, not early.
He was projected to go anywhere from the 2nd to early 5th rounds.
If his release is so slow, his accuracy so poor and he stares down receivers, why are many of his statistics better than Matt Ryan’s? In addition he played in a pro-style offense at Kentucky, so those stats, compared to some other QBs, are not skewed by having the benefit of throwing in a run and shoot.
Ernie Accorsi, Jerry Reese’s predecessor and mentor as GM for the Giants, was a pretty good assessor of talent. In the recent book about him, he specifically mentions a slow delivery as a serious QB defect. I’m pretty sure his tutoring of Reese included this concept. If that is the case, why would Reese even consider Woodson?
I’m willing to bet that Woodson leapfrogs Lorenzen and the other QB to be the back-up by next year. I can see why the kid would be disappointed by slipping to the 6th, but it’s stooopid to blame anything other than circumstance for that slide.
We all, of course, are aware of the spectacular players who find their way to the top after all the ‘experts’ ignore or ridicule them. Just sayin’.
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May 13th, 2008 at 12:41 pm
I’m not McShay’s biggest fan but I am in agreement with most here that McShay is not to blame for “misleading” Woodson. McShay, Green and others are paid to voice their opinions on the air and just like the rest of us can be wrong a lot. They are paid a lot b/c they are in high profile jobs. If this “league source” thinks he can do better than he should apply for the freaking job and show us what he’s got.
As Florio has often pointed out when posting his mock drafts, a few crazy picks/trades in the middle of round one can have a tremendous impact on the rest of the draft and render every mock draft worthless. So how in the heck can McShay, Green or any of these others deserve blame for Woodson’s naivete?
Regarding ESPN, they were founded by sports reporters then later operated under the umbrella of ABC until the mid-1990’s when ABC was acquired by Disney. Since then, Disney has decided that the “Entertainment and Sports News” channel should become just that–a sports news and sports entertainment channel with an emphasis on the entertainment part. The senior leadership is under the “vision” of a company built on entertainment fluff. It is not altogether shocking that ESPN has transformed itself into sports reporting fluff. What is surprising to me is how much this fluff has infiltrated into day to day programming. I commented in another thread about a horrible segment involving Garnett and Bill Russell which looked more like Dr. Phil than Sportscenter.
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May 13th, 2008 at 1:29 pm
Those experts on the NFLN’s show during the draft were good. Really good. You’d think ESPN could hire some experts too.
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May 13th, 2008 at 1:38 pm
Whoever this source is has an awfully high opinion of scout, meaning most likely he himself is one. While I think McShay is a moron too its not like scouts do a great job of perdicting how college talent will translate to the NFL level. If they were Tom Brady would have been picked earlier than the 6th round, not to mention the numerous busts that have been taken in the 1st round, but this source is right McShay has nothing to lose with his Mock Drafts, but now if Andre Woodson is the next Tom Brady he’ll look like just as big of a moron, but I guess thats why he’s an unnamed source.
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May 13th, 2008 at 1:54 pm
PSMITH, a Cheerleader, says:
“If Woodson made his decision based strictly on internet mock drafts, he is an idiot. What was his Wonderlic score?”
Woodson scored a 14. Know what the average is for QBs? 24. You know which position has the highest average Wonderlic? Offensive tackle at 26.
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May 13th, 2008 at 2:10 pm
this boggled my mind so much it made me sign up just to comment. are you freaking kidding me pft? this guy mcshay’s job is to put together a “MOCK” draft to give viewers and fans an idea of what’s what as far as talent and possible draft position. since when are they to be held accountable as far as being right or wrong? wouldn’t they be working for an NFL franchise if that were the case. this makes me sick that it would even be out here. Ripping mcshay for doing his job? He is on air for fans and viewers to give his opinion and to help out people that work and don’t have time to study every player out there and want to follow the draft. This stuff is getting REDICULE!!!
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May 13th, 2008 at 2:20 pm
one more thing, this is the equivalent of me going out and buying Madden08 and trading 85 to the eagles, and then calling up andy reid in real life and yelling at him for it not actully being reality.. seriously it is THAT stupid IMO.
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May 13th, 2008 at 9:43 pm
Are we really having this conversation? Florio, you know you’re my boy, but you’re starting to get a little ridiculous with your seemingly anti-ESPN posts. How can McShay possibly be held responsible for where Woodson did or didn’t get drafted? And why are we ripping McShay for being wrong in a mock…that’s right, mock draft? if any of the “experts” could accurately predict every pick correctly, there probably wouldn’t be any need to actually hold a draft…McShay and Kiper could just tell all the rookies where they were going. Come on Florio, I know it’s a slow time of year, but resist the urge to post nonsense. You’re better than that.
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May 14th, 2008 at 1:48 am
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with Florio posing a question. After all, it was a question and not a statement. It’s a fair critique. Both McShay and Kiper come off as know-it-alls and even argue (I’m sure this is staged by ESPN in a further attempt to sensationalize everything) over who is more right.
This is a great post by Florio because it calls out McShay for being not nearly as great as he would have you believe.
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May 14th, 2008 at 2:51 pm
This is ridiculous. Any player expecting to find out where they will go based on a Mock Draft should go back to school and get more of an education. Also, the actual scouts and player development departments in NFL departments miss on players all of the time, as evidenced by PFT looking back at the 2005 draft and pointing out that nearly half the first round picks were busts. I am sure that your source has missed on plenty of picks his team has made, so to throw McShay under the bus was uncalled for.
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