Comments on: 2005 FIRST ROUND LITTERED WITH BUSTS http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/ The Best Pro Football Scoop on the Internet Tue, 02 Dec 2008 07:29:54 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.2 By: Sid http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-27539 Sid Sun, 11 May 2008 08:01:10 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-27539 Ridiculous. Ronnie Brown is one of the best RBs in the NFL. Not only is he not a bust, he was a great pick. He played better than any RB in the NFL last year. It's too bad his season was cut short by injury. Rolle is not a bust. Ridiculous. Ronnie Brown is one of the best RBs in the NFL. Not only is he not a bust, he was a great pick. He played better than any RB in the NFL last year. It’s too bad his season was cut short by injury.

Rolle is not a bust.

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]]> By: joepinion http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-25377 joepinion Wed, 07 May 2008 11:47:40 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-25377 Part 2 coming??? Part 2 coming???

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]]> By: empty13 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-25187 empty13 Tue, 06 May 2008 22:30:36 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-25187 if a player is derailed by injuries, then it can still be called a WASTED pick or trade or signing. maybe a BUST or a WASTE will recover and play better later, even like smith finally learning the position, like a lot of veteran QBs seem to do after some missteps. if a player is derailed by injuries, then it can still be called a WASTED pick or trade or signing.

maybe a BUST or a WASTE will recover and play better later, even like smith finally learning the position, like a lot of veteran QBs seem to do after some missteps.

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]]> By: gob http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-25102 gob Tue, 06 May 2008 20:33:20 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-25102 Excellent work, Florio. This is the way that draft grades should be handed out. Please post the second half of the round soon!!! By the way, great website. Excellent work, Florio. This is the way that draft grades should be handed out. Please post the second half of the round soon!!!

By the way, great website.

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]]> By: efrencio http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24862 efrencio Tue, 06 May 2008 15:48:05 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24862 look... this is alex's 4rth year right. give him this last season to rate him. its not right to judge him with all the situations he has gone through. he has shown signs in being able to win games(cardinals last year and the seahawks 2 years ago) everybody is just making a big deal about the 3 qbs competition. you know that smith is going to get the starting job cuz of the money issue.i hear every coach say that the qb spot is always competative and that its going to be up for grabs. dont forget that the niners were 2 and 0 last year to start the season. then on the 3rd game he got that shoulder injury. not to mention that cordinator that the niners had was awful. lets see how he does with martz and wait to see if people can call him a bust. look… this is alex’s 4rth year right. give him this last season to rate him. its not right to judge him with all the situations he has gone through. he has shown signs in being able to win games(cardinals last year and the seahawks 2 years ago) everybody is just making a big deal about the 3 qbs competition. you know that smith is going to get the starting job cuz of the money issue.i hear every coach say that the qb spot is always competative and that its going to be up for grabs. dont forget that the niners were 2 and 0 last year to start the season. then on the 3rd game he got that shoulder injury. not to mention that cordinator that the niners had was awful. lets see how he does with martz and wait to see if people can call him a bust.

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]]> By: Bradybunch http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24627 Bradybunch Tue, 06 May 2008 00:16:11 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24627 I can't belive how many people are defending YUGO Williams. He has NEVER played 16 games in three years. Yes durabilaty counts. He has only topped 1000 yrds once (as a rookie)and it was close (1178) In his three years he has 10 TD's and 8 fumbles (losing 7) People HE WAS THE FIFTH OVERALL PICK!!!! BUST! Then again some think Ricky Williams isn't a bust(47 TD 36 fumbles and not a strong desire to play football). Mabey I don't understand value, but a first round pick should be a franchies player not a journyman. I can’t belive how many people are defending YUGO Williams.
He has NEVER played 16 games in three years. Yes durabilaty counts.
He has only topped 1000 yrds once (as a rookie)and it was close (1178)
In his three years he has 10 TD’s and 8 fumbles (losing 7)
People HE WAS THE FIFTH OVERALL PICK!!!! BUST!
Then again some think Ricky Williams isn’t a bust(47 TD 36 fumbles and not a strong desire to play football). Mabey I don’t understand value, but a first round pick should be a franchies player not a journyman.

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]]> By: PFT Planet Idiot http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24576 PFT Planet Idiot Mon, 05 May 2008 22:08:57 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24576 Merriman blowed up Holmes when he was shooting up his roids. He got debacled by Jones-Drew after he came off his needle. Merriman blowed up Holmes when he was shooting up his roids. He got debacled by Jones-Drew after he came off his needle.

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]]> By: Alanboy395 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24557 Alanboy395 Mon, 05 May 2008 21:36:21 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24557 05 was a good year to pick 11-15. All those players are at worst solid performers. Alex Smith did not get a fair chance. His weapons are non-existant and his team's staff and front office is completely unstable. I'm not ready to give up on Antrell Rolle yet. He may still be a serviceable safety. Not what you may want for the No. 8 pick but anything Arizona gets out of him will be better than picks number 6 and 7. 05 was a good year to pick 11-15. All those players are at worst solid performers. Alex Smith did not get a fair chance. His weapons are non-existant and his team’s staff and front office is completely unstable. I’m not ready to give up on Antrell Rolle yet. He may still be a serviceable safety. Not what you may want for the No. 8 pick but anything Arizona gets out of him will be better than picks number 6 and 7.

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]]> By: RonO http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24496 RonO Mon, 05 May 2008 19:26:46 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24496 I guess Steve Young was a bust too. I'll let you tell him. And Eli Manning. I guess Steve Young was a bust too. I’ll let you tell him. And Eli Manning.

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]]> By: ppdoc http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24489 ppdoc Mon, 05 May 2008 19:21:12 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24489 in regard to bpaliobeis - are you stupid or just a ravens hater. lets see - hmmm.... Haloti Ngata - 1st round pick - one of the best tackles in the game. taken by the Wizard of Oz. The next year Ben Grubbs - taken at the end of the first round. Starting by mid season will likely be a probowl offensive lineman. So since Phil Savage left the Ravens have had 2 first round picks, both of which are likely to be probowlers (Ngata should have been last year). Granted Phil Savage has done a nice job, but you Cleveland fans were calling for his head at the beginning of last year before your stinking team played one of the easiest schedules in the NFL and managed to squeeze out 10 games. When Phil Savage has a track record of YEARS of probowlers like Ozzie then come back and talk to me. Until then crawl back into your hole near the lake and be happy that your owner saw the benefit in stealing our personnel people. in regard to bpaliobeis - are you stupid or just a ravens hater. lets see - hmmm…. Haloti Ngata - 1st round pick - one of the best tackles in the game. taken by the Wizard of Oz. The next year Ben Grubbs - taken at the end of the first round. Starting by mid season will likely be a probowl offensive lineman. So since Phil Savage left the Ravens have had 2 first round picks, both of which are likely to be probowlers (Ngata should have been last year). Granted Phil Savage has done a nice job, but you Cleveland fans were calling for his head at the beginning of last year before your stinking team played one of the easiest schedules in the NFL and managed to squeeze out 10 games. When Phil Savage has a track record of YEARS of probowlers like Ozzie then come back and talk to me. Until then crawl back into your hole near the lake and be happy that your owner saw the benefit in stealing our personnel people.

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]]> By: empty13 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24469 empty13 Mon, 05 May 2008 18:43:26 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24469 cincy has some considerable offensive talent. even when they were a bad team they got into shootouts. pittsbirgh is a good team. under nolan, frisco is fried, and usually not as good as their record might indicate. not saying smith is good. but being on a good team, or one with some talent, makes all the diff in the world. also, florio may need a gun, with all the criticism he dishes out to those who dont respond well to it. cincy has some considerable offensive talent. even when they were a bad team they got into shootouts. pittsbirgh is a good team. under nolan, frisco is fried, and usually not as good as their record might indicate.

not saying smith is good. but being on a good team, or one with some talent, makes all the diff in the world.

also, florio may need a gun, with all the criticism he dishes out to those who dont respond well to it.

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]]> By: stlrzfan http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24440 stlrzfan Mon, 05 May 2008 18:17:00 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24440 Oh man, Florio, what an excellent idea! You have spawned a cottage industry here. You can't stop now. I think Carson Palmer, Ben Rothlisberger, hell even a lowly 6th round pick like Brady, clearly show that if you can play, you can play. Smith is a bust. Oh man, Florio, what an excellent idea! You have spawned a cottage industry here. You can’t stop now. I think Carson Palmer, Ben Rothlisberger, hell even a lowly 6th round pick like Brady, clearly show that if you can play, you can play. Smith is a bust.

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]]> By: happybunny http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24419 happybunny Mon, 05 May 2008 17:54:44 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24419 Let's see...Carlos Rogers' nickname by the fans is "Toast" (as in he gets burned). So by my definition, he is a <b>BUST</b>. Let’s see…Carlos Rogers’ nickname by the fans is “Toast” (as in he gets burned). So by my definition, he is a BUST.

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]]> By: texasPHINSfan http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24413 texasPHINSfan Mon, 05 May 2008 17:48:48 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24413 i don't think Brown is a bust.... given that he was leading the league in yards from scrimmage up until his injury last year, that is FAR from a bust. He had more yards than LT! I WILL admit his injuries are too frequent, but last year's was a freak injury making a tackle from an INT thrown b/c of poor QB play. The rest of your list i'll agree with, however. There should be some sort of definition line drawn between straight-up BUSTS from sucking, and busts from injury concerns. :) i don’t think Brown is a bust…. given that he was leading the league in yards from scrimmage up until his injury last year, that is FAR from a bust. He had more yards than LT! I WILL admit his injuries are too frequent, but last year’s was a freak injury making a tackle from an INT thrown b/c of poor QB play.

The rest of your list i’ll agree with, however.

There should be some sort of definition line drawn between straight-up BUSTS from sucking, and busts from injury concerns. :)

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]]> By: gbo6969 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24406 gbo6969 Mon, 05 May 2008 17:42:33 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24406 I like it except for one thing as a Redskins fan I would definitley say Carlos Rogers is a bust any skins fan knows he couldnt catch bees with honey the guy coulda had 10 ints 2 yrs ago if it weren't for his butterfingers sorry Carlos but your a bust!!!!! I like it except for one thing as a Redskins fan I would definitley say Carlos Rogers is a bust any skins fan knows he couldnt catch bees with honey the guy coulda had 10 ints 2 yrs ago if it weren’t for his butterfingers sorry Carlos but your a bust!!!!!

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]]> By: Lanjoith http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24401 Lanjoith Mon, 05 May 2008 17:35:38 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24401 Hmm, let’s see. Merriman was Defensive Rookie of the year, has made the Pro Bowl all 3 years he has played and has registered double digit sacks all 3 years as well. Led the league in sacks in '06 & would have more than likely led the league again in '07 if not for Ted Cotrell's more conservative scheme that called for Merriman to drop into coverage more, and yet all you can talk about is steroids? Why don't people jump down Julius Peppers throat about being suspended for a banned substance? He missed 4 games his rookie year because of it but you never hear about it. Yeah, Merriman is a tad flashy and has rubbed some people the wrong way with his sack dance but the guy is money. SI just did a re-draft of the '05 draft and they had SF taking Merriman #1 overall. I like Demarcus Ware and he is a great player and will do really well in Wade Phillips defense but he is no Shawne Merriman. Hmm, let’s see. Merriman was Defensive Rookie of the year, has made the Pro Bowl all 3 years he has played and has registered double digit sacks all 3 years as well. Led the league in sacks in ‘06 & would have more than likely led the league again in ‘07 if not for Ted Cotrell’s more conservative scheme that called for Merriman to drop into coverage more, and yet all you can talk about is steroids? Why don’t people jump down Julius Peppers throat about being suspended for a banned substance? He missed 4 games his rookie year because of it but you never hear about it. Yeah, Merriman is a tad flashy and has rubbed some people the wrong way with his sack dance but the guy is money. SI just did a re-draft of the ‘05 draft and they had SF taking Merriman #1 overall. I like Demarcus Ware and he is a great player and will do really well in Wade Phillips defense but he is no Shawne Merriman.

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]]> By: Someone http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24400 Someone Mon, 05 May 2008 17:33:38 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24400 I agree with DwayneRudd: I don't think a person should be labeled a "BUST" because of an injury. I agree with DwayneRudd:

I don’t think a person should be labeled a “BUST” because of an injury.

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]]> By: StPete2you http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24399 StPete2you Mon, 05 May 2008 17:33:28 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24399 Compare the career stats of Ronnie Brown and Cadillac Williams, and the edge goes to Ronnie Brown. Keep in mind that Brown has not exactly been running behind Larry Little, Jim Langer, and Bob Kuechenberg the last 3 years. The Bucs, on the other hand, have a good and improving offensive line. Notice the yards per carry and productivity catching the ball out of the backfield. Cadillac, 32 career games, 569-2184 3.8 10 TDs; 53 REC 294 5.5 0 TDs Brown, 35 career games, 567-2517 4.4 13 TDs; 104 REC 897 8.6 2 TDs Compare the career stats of Ronnie Brown and Cadillac Williams, and the edge goes to Ronnie Brown. Keep in mind that Brown has not exactly been running behind Larry Little, Jim Langer, and Bob Kuechenberg the last 3 years. The Bucs, on the other hand, have a good and improving offensive line. Notice the yards per carry and productivity catching the ball out of the backfield.

Cadillac, 32 career games, 569-2184 3.8 10 TDs; 53 REC 294 5.5 0 TDs

Brown, 35 career games, 567-2517 4.4 13 TDs; 104 REC 897 8.6 2 TDs

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]]> By: richda http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24396 richda Mon, 05 May 2008 17:22:58 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24396 I feel for Alex Smith with his lack of a constant offense but still as a qb you gotta make plays. When he led s.f. on a game winning drive against Arizona last year, I thought maybe he had finally come out of his shell, a couple of injuries later and he is done. The guy has been getting murdered by opposing defenses every year and every game, is it his fault? Maybe not but David Carr got sacked more than any other player during the span, and look at where he is now. I remember it was between Aaron Rodgers and Alex Smith for the first pick, Alex made a lot of money but Rodgers got to sit behind one of the greatest qbs to ever play the game. So who really got the better out of that situation between them. As far as the lions go, have they made a good pick since Sanders? I feel for Alex Smith with his lack of a constant offense but still as a qb you gotta make plays. When he led s.f. on a game winning drive against Arizona last year, I thought maybe he had finally come out of his shell, a couple of injuries later and he is done. The guy has been getting murdered by opposing defenses every year and every game, is it his fault? Maybe not but David Carr got sacked more than any other player during the span, and look at where he is now. I remember it was between Aaron Rodgers and Alex Smith for the first pick, Alex made a lot of money but Rodgers got to sit behind one of the greatest qbs to ever play the game. So who really got the better out of that situation between them. As far as the lions go, have they made a good pick since Sanders?

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]]> By: Grulks http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24391 Grulks Mon, 05 May 2008 17:07:01 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24391 It's hard to accurately call a QB a bust after 3 seasons. I'm no 49ers fan, so I don't particularly care for Alex Smith, but it's far too early to call him a bust. Just ask Brett Favre, Steve Young, and Vinnie Testaverde, all labeled complete failures by the team that drafted them (and a lot of the fans/media, etc). Two of them are without a doubt had HOF careers, the other was certainly better than average, but not great. GRanted, Young wasn't a first round draft pick (first pick of supplemental) but the point is, each of these were deemed busts, and none of them turned out to be. It’s hard to accurately call a QB a bust after 3 seasons. I’m no 49ers fan, so I don’t particularly care for Alex Smith, but it’s far too early to call him a bust. Just ask Brett Favre, Steve Young, and Vinnie Testaverde, all labeled complete failures by the team that drafted them (and a lot of the fans/media, etc). Two of them are without a doubt had HOF careers, the other was certainly better than average, but not great. GRanted, Young wasn’t a first round draft pick (first pick of supplemental) but the point is, each of these were deemed busts, and none of them turned out to be.

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]]> By: KramersPalLomez http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24389 KramersPalLomez Mon, 05 May 2008 17:02:10 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24389 Derrick Johnson is one of the most underrated players in the league. You can compare his numbers in 2007 to Lance Briggs, who made the Pro Bowl playing in the same Cover 2 scheme. And Johnson constantly puts up better numbers than Merriman in every measure but sacks, which stands to reason since Johnson doesn't rush the passer nearly as often. Derrick Johnson is one of the most underrated players in the league. You can compare his numbers in 2007 to Lance Briggs, who made the Pro Bowl playing in the same Cover 2 scheme. And Johnson constantly puts up better numbers than Merriman in every measure but sacks, which stands to reason since Johnson doesn’t rush the passer nearly as often.

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]]> By: 4evrnyt http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24387 4evrnyt Mon, 05 May 2008 16:55:49 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24387 How can you possibly call Alex Smith a bust. 1-He was forced to play his first season because the QB's in front of him were terrible 2-His second season he played brilliantly. Everyone in the league said he was going to be a great QB and that the 49ers were heading for the playoffs 3- 3rd game of the 3rd season he gets his shoulder ripped apart. He tries to play before having surgery and it's still damaged. Alex Smith is entering his 4th season. He's 24 years old this week and is on his 4th Offensive Coordinator. Please explain to me how anyone can possibly fairly judge what kind of QB Alex Smith is. And can we please not forget that he's been trying to play on one of the worst teams of the past decade?? Please people, show a little football knowledge and give the kid a chance to actually prove himself. How can you possibly call Alex Smith a bust.

1-He was forced to play his first season because the QB’s in front of him were terrible
2-His second season he played brilliantly. Everyone in the league said he was going to be a great QB and that the 49ers were heading for the playoffs
3- 3rd game of the 3rd season he gets his shoulder ripped apart. He tries to play before having surgery and it’s still damaged.

Alex Smith is entering his 4th season. He’s 24 years old this week and is on his 4th Offensive Coordinator.

Please explain to me how anyone can possibly fairly judge what kind of QB Alex Smith is. And can we please not forget that he’s been trying to play on one of the worst teams of the past decade??

Please people, show a little football knowledge and give the kid a chance to actually prove himself.

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]]> By: brasho http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24386 brasho Mon, 05 May 2008 16:53:39 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24386 How can you people say that Carnell Williams is not a bust? He is horrible! Aside from his first 3 games in the league, he has rushed for 100 yards in a game only a few more times, once in the past two seasons or so. He runs east-west always trying to break the big play yet he doesn't have the breakaway speed to do anything if he did. You can't point to one injury and say he's a bust becaue he got hurt, you can look at his history of being constantly injured. Also, Carnell Williams might have the worst hands for pass catching in the NFL... Last season he caught 3 passes, he also dropped 3 passes... he is a liability when on the field which basically means he is an enormous BUST! How can you people say that Carnell Williams is not a bust? He is horrible! Aside from his first 3 games in the league, he has rushed for 100 yards in a game only a few more times, once in the past two seasons or so. He runs east-west always trying to break the big play yet he doesn’t have the breakaway speed to do anything if he did. You can’t point to one injury and say he’s a bust becaue he got hurt, you can look at his history of being constantly injured. Also, Carnell Williams might have the worst hands for pass catching in the NFL… Last season he caught 3 passes, he also dropped 3 passes… he is a liability when on the field which basically means he is an enormous BUST!

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]]> By: NoSoup4U http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24381 NoSoup4U Mon, 05 May 2008 16:31:08 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24381 - 7. Troy Williamson, receiver, Vikings: We once tried to throw Williamson a compliment, but he dropped that, too. BUST. - I almost wet myself. BRILLIANT! Soup for everyone. On Ronnie Brown, he was averaging 5.2 yards per carry and well on his way to a 1,200 yard season before his injury last season behind an offensive line that was down right offensive- for lack of a better savvy description. He's far from being a bust. It would be nice to see him finish an entire season though. - 7. Troy Williamson, receiver, Vikings: We once tried to throw Williamson a compliment, but he dropped that, too. BUST. -

I almost wet myself. BRILLIANT! Soup for everyone.

On Ronnie Brown, he was averaging 5.2 yards per carry and well on his way to a 1,200 yard season before his injury last season behind an offensive line that was down right offensive- for lack of a better savvy description. He’s far from being a bust. It would be nice to see him finish an entire season though.

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]]> By: Buccaboo http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24378 Buccaboo Mon, 05 May 2008 16:25:31 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24378 Florio is right about Cadillac Williams. If you can't stay healthy enough to play, you are a bust. He isn't scoring TD's or helping win games when he's hurt...and he has been hurt every year. Go back another year and label Michael Clayton a bust too. Florio is right about Cadillac Williams. If you can’t stay healthy enough to play, you are a bust. He isn’t scoring TD’s or helping win games when he’s hurt…and he has been hurt every year. Go back another year and label Michael Clayton a bust too.

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]]> By: Batman1113 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24376 Batman1113 Mon, 05 May 2008 16:22:00 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24376 Brasho: Three seasons is the exact point to evaluate a QB's development. A top flight QB should have come into his own during the third season as a starter. Smith is not the answer in SF. As Florio stated, if he is still battling for a roster spot in his 4th year than he is a BUST. Brasho: Three seasons is the exact point to evaluate a QB’s development. A top flight QB should have come into his own during the third season as a starter. Smith is not the answer in SF. As Florio stated, if he is still battling for a roster spot in his 4th year than he is a BUST.

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]]> By: Batman1113 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24375 Batman1113 Mon, 05 May 2008 16:19:37 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24375 You all keep comparing Williams (Caddy) to Brown. The truth is that Brown is by far the superior back. Williams had a decent first year but even faded at the end of that one. Brown had two solid season and was well on the way to a third when getting injured. Brown is not a bust, as long as he can come back. Williams is a bust due to the ineptitude of Gruden to effectively change his system to meet the skills of his players. His hard headedness in that will lead to his eventual (and should have happened already) firing. For being a QB "genious" he has yet to develop anyone in Tampa and misused both Williams and Alstott every season sicne the first team, which was Dungy's. You all keep comparing Williams (Caddy) to Brown. The truth is that Brown is by far the superior back. Williams had a decent first year but even faded at the end of that one. Brown had two solid season and was well on the way to a third when getting injured. Brown is not a bust, as long as he can come back. Williams is a bust due to the ineptitude of Gruden to effectively change his system to meet the skills of his players. His hard headedness in that will lead to his eventual (and should have happened already) firing. For being a QB “genious” he has yet to develop anyone in Tampa and misused both Williams and Alstott every season sicne the first team, which was Dungy’s.

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]]> By: Referee http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24369 Referee Mon, 05 May 2008 16:07:14 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24369 Ronnie Brown was having an exceptional year in 2007 with undoubtedly a horrible team prior to his ACL injury... He may or may not fully recover but assuming he does and by projecting a healthy Ronnie Brown and Ricky 'My Main Man' Williams, as a dynamic running option in tandem with a good nucleus of O-Line help added by The Sparano's. You'll have to strongly take Ronnie Brown's name out of further consideration for the dreaded 'BUST' syndrome. Ronnie Brown was having an exceptional year in 2007 with undoubtedly a horrible team prior to his ACL injury… He may or may not fully recover but assuming he does and by projecting a healthy Ronnie Brown and Ricky ‘My Main Man’ Williams, as a dynamic running option in tandem with a good nucleus of O-Line help added by The Sparano’s. You’ll have to strongly take Ronnie Brown’s name out of further consideration for the dreaded ‘BUST’ syndrome.

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]]> By: josereyes0 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24367 josereyes0 Mon, 05 May 2008 16:01:51 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24367 With the way the NFL talent behaves these days, I'm starting to be a little concerned for your overall safety Florio. With the way the NFL talent behaves these days, I’m starting to be a little concerned for your overall safety Florio.

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]]> By: NonYahooHotmailAcct http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24365 NonYahooHotmailAcct Mon, 05 May 2008 15:55:02 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24365 The only one I disagree with is Alex Smith. Give him Norv Turner for 3-4 years and watch him become Eli-Manning-In-The-Playoffs-Like. And Cadillac is a BUST only because of injuries. He is really good in the 20 games he plays... per decade. The only one I disagree with is Alex Smith. Give him Norv Turner for 3-4 years and watch him become Eli-Manning-In-The-Playoffs-Like.

And Cadillac is a BUST only because of injuries. He is really good in the 20 games he plays… per decade.

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]]> By: marvelous http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24366 marvelous Mon, 05 May 2008 15:55:02 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24366 I think your assessment of Carlos Rogers is a bit harsh. I thought he was an above average CB on a good defense. You can't expect Pro Bowls for every 1st round pick. He's a decent player. Maybe not what you expect from the #9 pick in the draft, but he is not a bust. I think your assessment of Carlos Rogers is a bit harsh. I thought he was an above average CB on a good defense. You can’t expect Pro Bowls for every 1st round pick. He’s a decent player. Maybe not what you expect from the #9 pick in the draft, but he is not a bust.

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]]> By: stetai http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24363 stetai Mon, 05 May 2008 15:42:28 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24363 Kudos for doing this analysis. With so many bold predictions made before and after the draft by media types, its good to read someone actually go back and analyze how these draft classes performed. Kudos for doing this analysis. With so many bold predictions made before and after the draft by media types, its good to read someone actually go back and analyze how these draft classes performed.

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]]> By: Jagdbaer http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24360 Jagdbaer Mon, 05 May 2008 15:30:30 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24360 Let's see...Shawn Merriman gets "blown up" by a Maurice Jones-Drew but then he also "blew up" Priest Holmes so bad that Holmes is no longer in the league! I'd say that was a "Lights out" performance! Call it a wash. Let’s see…Shawn Merriman gets “blown up” by a Maurice Jones-Drew but then he also “blew up” Priest Holmes so bad that Holmes is no longer in the league! I’d say that was a “Lights out” performance! Call it a wash.

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]]> By: Orenthal James http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24352 Orenthal James Mon, 05 May 2008 15:04:35 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24352 ---"I’m not sure it’s fair to label C. Williams a BUST but not R. Brown. I’d rather have Ronnie Brown right now, too, over Cadillac Williams, but they aren’t THAT far apart that one’s a bust and one isn’t. They’ve both suffered serious injuries and have yet to come back from them. Give them another year or two." It is very fair to call Cadillac a BUST and not Ronnie... afterall, which running back was REGRESSING while the other was on his way to a PRO BOWL season prior to the injuries??? —”I’m not sure it’s fair to label C. Williams a BUST but not R. Brown. I’d rather have Ronnie Brown right now, too, over Cadillac Williams, but they aren’t THAT far apart that one’s a bust and one isn’t. They’ve both suffered serious injuries and have yet to come back from them. Give them another year or two.”

It is very fair to call Cadillac a BUST and not Ronnie… afterall, which running back was REGRESSING while the other was on his way to a PRO BOWL season prior to the injuries???

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]]> By: TheFutt http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24346 TheFutt Mon, 05 May 2008 14:53:06 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24346 "Calling Chucky’s Cadillac a bust goes a bit too far in my eyes. RBs are always a gamble. He clearly showed that he can perform. It’s simply idiotic to take a RB that high. I wouldn’t call the pick “wasted”." So what the hell do you call a pick that, 3 years later, has no impact on the team? Of course it's a wasted pick...the guy might never play again. If the guy never puts his pad's on again...what else can you call the number 5 pick from the 2005 draft? WASTED. So if your #5 overall pick was a waste, that player must be a bust, right? Or does this just make way too much sense? “Calling Chucky’s Cadillac a bust goes a bit too far in my eyes. RBs are always a gamble. He clearly showed that he can perform. It’s simply idiotic to take a RB that high. I wouldn’t call the pick “wasted”.”

So what the hell do you call a pick that, 3 years later, has no impact on the team?

Of course it’s a wasted pick…the guy might never play again. If the guy never puts his pad’s on again…what else can you call the number 5 pick from the 2005 draft?

WASTED.

So if your #5 overall pick was a waste, that player must be a bust, right? Or does this just make way too much sense?

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]]> By: Jeremiah W http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24335 Jeremiah W Mon, 05 May 2008 14:36:26 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24335 It is about time we started looking back around draft time instead of hyping up a bunch of college players who may or may not be any good in the NFL. Phil Savage did a great job getting the best player in the draft with the #3 pick. Wimbley is a good player, but it is still a questionable move to trade down with the Ravens and pass on Nagta. Trying to fill that gap with fat DTs from other teams instead of taking the best 2 gap tackle in sevral years is a move that will come back to haunt the Clowns like those Lucy and Charlie Brown cartoons. The Ravens know how well Phil does his job, that is why they hired and developed him. Don't forget how close the Clowns were to canning him 2 years ago, and we would have welcomed him back. But befoe you go blowing his trumpet as a genius GM, let him win the division or at least make the playoffs. Plenty of teams that look good on paper also get a wipe of the Browns. It is about time we started looking back around draft time instead of hyping up a bunch of college players who may or may not be any good in the NFL.

Phil Savage did a great job getting the best player in the draft with the #3 pick. Wimbley is a good player, but it is still a questionable move to trade down with the Ravens and pass on Nagta. Trying to fill that gap with fat DTs from other teams instead of taking the best 2 gap tackle in sevral years is a move that will come back to haunt the Clowns like those Lucy and Charlie Brown cartoons.

The Ravens know how well Phil does his job, that is why they hired and developed him. Don’t forget how close the Clowns were to canning him 2 years ago, and we would have welcomed him back. But befoe you go blowing his trumpet as a genius GM, let him win the division or at least make the playoffs. Plenty of teams that look good on paper also get a wipe of the Browns.

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]]> By: TCLARK http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24333 TCLARK Mon, 05 May 2008 14:34:59 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24333 I too agree that many rookies never live up to there 1st round status,But there are as many second thru 7th(undrafted) that out perform there rookie contracts as well. The current system is not that bad. The good teams tend to draft well, and the bad teams have terrible draft history. If everyone drafted well, then we would really have parody. Admit it 95% of you would have paid Reggie Bush how much to go #1? Turns out he should have been a third rounder. The pay scale probibly needs tweeked. But that won't help teams draft any better. Bad teams make bad personel moves weather it's in the draft or free agency. I too agree that many rookies never live up to there 1st round status,But there are as many second thru 7th(undrafted) that out perform there rookie contracts as well. The current system is not that bad. The good teams tend to draft well, and the bad teams have terrible draft history. If everyone drafted well, then we would really have parody. Admit it 95% of you would have paid Reggie Bush how much to go #1? Turns out he should have been a third rounder. The pay scale probibly needs tweeked. But that won’t help teams draft any better. Bad teams make bad personel moves weather it’s in the draft or free agency.

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]]> By: Mark Troy http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24330 Mark Troy Mon, 05 May 2008 14:31:59 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24330 It would be interesting to go back and see what teams were given what "draft grades" by the pundits at the time to see if those grades were realized. It would be interesting to go back and see what teams were given what “draft grades” by the pundits at the time to see if those grades were realized.

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]]> By: Stoogie http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24327 Stoogie Mon, 05 May 2008 14:24:24 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24327 The 8 players that Florio identified as busts signed contracts worth a total of $227.3 million in '05. Of course, what they got versus what they signed for are two completely different things. But some of them made out pretty damn well. Mike Williams had over $10 million of his contract guaranteed. I didn't bother to look at what was guaranteed... I don't have THAT much time on my hands. The 8 players that Florio identified as busts signed contracts worth a total of $227.3 million in ‘05. Of course, what they got versus what they signed for are two completely different things. But some of them made out pretty damn well. Mike Williams had over $10 million of his contract guaranteed. I didn’t bother to look at what was guaranteed… I don’t have THAT much time on my hands.

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]]> By: teetee http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24326 teetee Mon, 05 May 2008 14:23:59 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24326 Smith was a dumb pick by the 49ers, but he is still too young to be truly labelled a bust - at least give him a chance in Martz offense first. Florio, examine how many busts have come from USC in the last few years, off the top of my head - Williams, Jarrett, Leinhart(?), Bush (?), Lenwhale(?) have all been busts or massive underachievers. I mention it cos a boatload more were taken this year... Smith was a dumb pick by the 49ers, but he is still too young to be truly labelled a bust - at least give him a chance in Martz offense first.

Florio, examine how many busts have come from USC in the last few years, off the top of my head - Williams, Jarrett, Leinhart(?), Bush (?), Lenwhale(?) have all been busts or massive underachievers. I mention it cos a boatload more were taken this year…

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]]> By: SCLEARY1212 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24323 SCLEARY1212 Mon, 05 May 2008 14:06:32 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24323 I'm a Lions fan (sigh) living in Tampa and I met Mike Williams about 2 weeks before the draft. All I could think as I walked away from that meeting is "Wow, whoever is dumb enough to draft this guy is going to be seriously regretting that decision." He was one of the dumbest human beings I've ever met. Good job Millen. I’m a Lions fan (sigh) living in Tampa and I met Mike Williams about 2 weeks before the draft. All I could think as I walked away from that meeting is “Wow, whoever is dumb enough to draft this guy is going to be seriously regretting that decision.” He was one of the dumbest human beings I’ve ever met. Good job Millen.

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]]> By: PFT Planet Idiot http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24314 PFT Planet Idiot Mon, 05 May 2008 13:50:14 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24314 This is great. You cannot hand out draft grades right after the draft. They are about as accurate as the mock draft that the talking heads created before the draft. This is great. You cannot hand out draft grades right after the draft. They are about as accurate as the mock draft that the talking heads created before the draft.

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]]> By: DwayneRudd http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24311 DwayneRudd Mon, 05 May 2008 13:48:09 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24311 I never liked calling a guy a "bust" just because he couldn't stay healthy. He's not a success, thats for sure, but scouts don't have crystal balls to see whose going to get hit by the freak injury. I never liked calling a guy a “bust” just because he couldn’t stay healthy. He’s not a success, thats for sure, but scouts don’t have crystal balls to see whose going to get hit by the freak injury.

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]]> By: Kotite http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24310 Kotite Mon, 05 May 2008 13:48:03 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24310 Um yeah... I hear the arguments, but Alex Smith is a bust. Having low grade receivers around you doesn't mean you lose the ability to hit the open man. I've seen him live and it wasn't pretty. Martz needs to perform a miracle of Helen Keller proportions in SF this year for Smith to edge out Shaun Hill. Um yeah… I hear the arguments, but Alex Smith is a bust. Having low grade receivers around you doesn’t mean you lose the ability to hit the open man. I’ve seen him live and it wasn’t pretty. Martz needs to perform a miracle of Helen Keller proportions in SF this year for Smith to edge out Shaun Hill.

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]]> By: matador68 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24306 matador68 Mon, 05 May 2008 13:43:30 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24306 2nd half of htis 1st round is feilled with more BUSTS...Demetrius Ware is probably the the best player of this awful draft class 2nd half of htis 1st round is feilled with more BUSTS…Demetrius Ware is probably the the best player of this awful draft class

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]]> By: ChrisJNelson http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24301 ChrisJNelson Mon, 05 May 2008 13:40:00 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24301 First of all, Brown's not a bust at all. You can't fault him for being the No. 2 pick in a really crappy draft class. Backs don't usually go that high, and the fact that three backs went on the Top 5 shows just how poor a draft class it was. But Brown has been damn good and has only had one knee injury and one freak injury. He's still been great and was leading the league in offensive yardage before he went down in Week 7 last year. He is the total opposite of a bust. Antrel Rolle's also damn good. If you think he's a bust you don't know football. First of all, Brown’s not a bust at all. You can’t fault him for being the No. 2 pick in a really crappy draft class. Backs don’t usually go that high, and the fact that three backs went on the Top 5 shows just how poor a draft class it was. But Brown has been damn good and has only had one knee injury and one freak injury. He’s still been great and was leading the league in offensive yardage before he went down in Week 7 last year. He is the total opposite of a bust.

Antrel Rolle’s also damn good. If you think he’s a bust you don’t know football.

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]]> By: Vox Veritas http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24300 Vox Veritas Mon, 05 May 2008 13:38:17 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24300 2005 was NOT the season to take a QB at #1 overall. The 49ers seriously reached for Alex Smith, and those that are not convinced that he's a bust as a #1 overall pick by now will be convinced very shortly. He may turn out to be a serviceable NFL QB, but you've got to get more than a JAG at #1 overall. Nothing but his contract is keeping him with the 49ers. They gave him $24 million in guaranteed money on a six year contract! BUST. 2005 was NOT the season to take a QB at #1 overall. The 49ers seriously reached for Alex Smith, and those that are not convinced that he’s a bust as a #1 overall pick by now will be convinced very shortly. He may turn out to be a serviceable NFL QB, but you’ve got to get more than a JAG at #1 overall. Nothing but his contract is keeping him with the 49ers. They gave him $24 million in guaranteed money on a six year contract! BUST.

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]]> By: hugh jorgen http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24296 hugh jorgen Mon, 05 May 2008 13:33:44 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24296 Ronnie Brown will be the 2008 MVP! Ronnie Brown will be the 2008 MVP!

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]]> By: bpaliobeis http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24291 bpaliobeis Mon, 05 May 2008 13:16:53 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24291 Seeems to me that Phil Savage is doing the one thing that previouse regimes for the Browns failed to do . . . make great first round picks. Edwards and Thomas are pro-bowlers. And Wimbley has the potential if he can get some inside help to force QB's deeper into the pocket. If they keep hitting on their first rounders and an occassionaly late rounder they should be competetive for the long haul. Based on what the Ravens have done since he left it seems clear who was actually the brains behind their successful drafts. Seeems to me that Phil Savage is doing the one thing that previouse regimes for the Browns failed to do . . . make great first round picks. Edwards and Thomas are pro-bowlers. And Wimbley has the potential if he can get some inside help to force QB’s deeper into the pocket. If they keep hitting on their first rounders and an occassionaly late rounder they should be competetive for the long haul. Based on what the Ravens have done since he left it seems clear who was actually the brains behind their successful drafts.

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]]> By: albaNY Hawker http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24290 albaNY Hawker Mon, 05 May 2008 13:15:40 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/05/05/2005-first-round-littered-with-busts/#comment-24290 THANK YOU! Every post-draft piece is either handing out arbitrary grades, or taking the high-and-mighty route of saying you can't properly grade a draft for 3 years....but then never grades the draft from three years ago! Not much to argue with in your first 16 picks. Can't wait to see how the back half shakes out. THANK YOU!

Every post-draft piece is either handing out arbitrary grades, or taking the high-and-mighty route of saying you can’t properly grade a draft for 3 years….but then never grades the draft from three years ago!

Not much to argue with in your first 16 picks. Can’t wait to see how the back half shakes out.

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