Comments on: RAVENS’ SYPNIEWSKI SUFFERS SERIOUS INJURY http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/ The Best Pro Football Scoop on the Internet Thu, 04 Dec 2008 22:03:49 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.2 By: monger http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17895 monger Mon, 21 Apr 2008 18:49:16 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17895 Dude, this is stoooopid. Guys get hurt all the time even when there's no contact. You're right about the issue in general, but ini this instance you're way off. Dude, this is stoooopid. Guys get hurt all the time even when there’s no contact. You’re right about the issue in general, but ini this instance you’re way off.

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]]> By: Neil Young and Geraldo http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17526 Neil Young and Geraldo Sun, 20 Apr 2008 06:39:53 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17526 Hi Florio, Thanks for keeping this an issue. We are sure it upsets those fans who "love" and "hate" different NFL teams, but as fans who view the sport through an objective lens, we admire the influential forum that you have cultivated. We are always worried that the NFL is attempting to stifle criticism through "quid-pro-quo" mechanisms and agreements such as bringing ESPN into the Monday Night Football franchise or buying ads on your site. But we see that at some level, you continue to bang the drum on numerous violations of procedural and distributive justice that occur in the NFL. Thanks. Although most fans don't care about these issues, the ability that you now have to shine a light on certain unjust behaviors and attitudes of the NFL is probably only rivaled by Sports Illustrated. And some may even argue that as a sole-proprietor of your corporation, you have more leeway and discretion than SI. We hope you are able to keep it up. The long term goals of a society are sometimes at odds with short-term desires. Although we are strong believers in capitalism, we believe liberty and freedom are cardinal human rights. Keep on keepin' on, like a bird that flew. Hi Florio,

Thanks for keeping this an issue. We are sure it upsets those fans who “love” and “hate” different NFL teams, but as fans who view the sport through an objective lens, we admire the influential forum that you have cultivated.

We are always worried that the NFL is attempting to stifle criticism through “quid-pro-quo” mechanisms and agreements such as bringing ESPN into the Monday Night Football franchise or buying ads on your site. But we see that at some level, you continue to bang the drum on numerous violations of procedural and distributive justice that occur in the NFL. Thanks.

Although most fans don’t care about these issues, the ability that you now have to shine a light on certain unjust behaviors and attitudes of the NFL is probably only rivaled by Sports Illustrated. And some may even argue that as a sole-proprietor of your corporation, you have more leeway and discretion than SI.

We hope you are able to keep it up. The long term goals of a society are sometimes at odds with short-term desires. Although we are strong believers in capitalism, we believe liberty and freedom are cardinal human rights.

Keep on keepin’ on, like a bird that flew.

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]]> By: MrMike http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17520 MrMike Sun, 20 Apr 2008 05:54:58 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17520 I think they should investigate the Packers practices. I could have sworn I saw some guys playing patty-cake on the bench the other day. I think they should investigate the Packers practices. I could have sworn I saw some guys playing patty-cake on the bench the other day.

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]]> By: jam11163000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17497 jam11163000 Sun, 20 Apr 2008 03:12:14 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17497 maby he slipped on a macdonalds wraper maby he slipped on a macdonalds wraper

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]]> By: jbizzle http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17495 jbizzle Sun, 20 Apr 2008 02:56:53 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17495 GIVE IT UP! NOBODY (BUT YOU) CARES! GIVE IT UP! NOBODY (BUT YOU) CARES!

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]]> By: The Jimmy http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17459 The Jimmy Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:28:45 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17459 The only way to avoid any contact is to not have the offense and defense on the field at the same time. And hope no two offensive players get in each other's way. The only way to avoid any contact is to not have the offense and defense on the field at the same time. And hope no two offensive players get in each other’s way.

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]]> By: ChrisJNelson http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17457 ChrisJNelson Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:04:55 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17457 How did Bill Gramatica tear his knee up? Exactly. How did Bill Gramatica tear his knee up? Exactly.

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]]> By: RavensFan19 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17447 RavensFan19 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 20:15:40 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17447 Whats up Skay??? Haven't seen you around the Baltimore Sun Ravens Board for a while. How's it going? Whats up Skay???

Haven’t seen you around the Baltimore Sun Ravens Board for a while.

How’s it going?

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]]> By: Dixon_Cox http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17444 Dixon_Cox Sat, 19 Apr 2008 19:59:51 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17444 Stuff like this will happen. Remember that RB for the Patriots who blew his knee playing flag football in the sand before the pro bowl? You never know when a dude is going get hurt. It's not a wink-wink deal. It's not a secret plan to have contact in a non-contact drill. Stuff like this will happen. Remember that RB for the Patriots who blew his knee playing flag football in the sand before the pro bowl? You never know when a dude is going get hurt. It’s not a wink-wink deal. It’s not a secret plan to have contact in a non-contact drill.

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]]> By: crichton08 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17441 crichton08 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 19:35:51 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17441 this is another dirty little league secret, like tampering. I know, maybe the NFL can punish the 49ers and everything will be better this is another dirty little league secret, like tampering. I know, maybe the NFL can punish the 49ers and everything will be better

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]]> By: brian_21 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17438 brian_21 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 19:20:17 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17438 Or, it could have been an unfortunate. As for this: "Common sense tells us that in a non-contact activity, not only should a player not awkwardly bump another player, he also shouldn’t have to make sudden movements that will cause his knee to buckle because he’s attempting to avoid contact." ... well, that's not true. Even if an activity is non contact, injuries can absolutely occur if the workout is intense, a knee buckles, you try to avoid running into some one, etc. Now, I still think there should probably be an investigation, but the injury doesn't mean that the Baltimore Ravens did anything wrong. Or, it could have been an unfortunate. As for this: “Common sense tells us that in a non-contact activity, not only should a player not awkwardly bump another player, he also shouldn’t have to make sudden movements that will cause his knee to buckle because he’s attempting to avoid contact.” … well, that’s not true. Even if an activity is non contact, injuries can absolutely occur if the workout is intense, a knee buckles, you try to avoid running into some one, etc.

Now, I still think there should probably be an investigation, but the injury doesn’t mean that the Baltimore Ravens did anything wrong.

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]]> By: teetee http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17432 teetee Sat, 19 Apr 2008 18:31:51 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17432 If anyone has ever played organised sports at any level, they would know that these sorts of accidents do happen. Until someone comes out and says Barnes levelled him rather than trying to get out of the way, i think everyone, including the amazing Florio, should take the report at face value and assume this was an accident. If anyone has ever played organised sports at any level, they would know that these sorts of accidents do happen. Until someone comes out and says Barnes levelled him rather than trying to get out of the way, i think everyone, including the amazing Florio, should take the report at face value and assume this was an accident.

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]]> By: darron01 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17431 darron01 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 18:30:12 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17431 As an intramural referee in college, I once saw 3 guys tear their ACL in one night of flag football games. Just because drills are non-contact doesn't mean they are "non-effort." When a pass is up in the air and a few 200+ pound athletes are moving full speed towards the ball, sometimes their bodies hit. And sometimes after the catch both parties need to swerve to avoid contact. It doesn't mean that one of them was trying to initiate contact, it just means that they were both trying for the ball. I realize that eliminating contact during the non-contact workouts is your personal crusade, but let's take a step back and be reasonable about this. It seems like the level of contact that's inevitable when I play touch football with my friends should be expected when you put a bunch of competitive NFL-caliber athletes on the field together. If you really expect "non-contact" to mean these guys to never touch each other, then they may as well just watch film. As an intramural referee in college, I once saw 3 guys tear their ACL in one night of flag football games.
Just because drills are non-contact doesn’t mean they are “non-effort.” When a pass is up in the air and a few 200+ pound athletes are moving full speed towards the ball, sometimes their bodies hit. And sometimes after the catch both parties need to swerve to avoid contact. It doesn’t mean that one of them was trying to initiate contact, it just means that they were both trying for the ball.
I realize that eliminating contact during the non-contact workouts is your personal crusade, but let’s take a step back and be reasonable about this. It seems like the level of contact that’s inevitable when I play touch football with my friends should be expected when you put a bunch of competitive NFL-caliber athletes on the field together. If you really expect “non-contact” to mean these guys to never touch each other, then they may as well just watch film.

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]]> By: Gameison http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17429 Gameison Sat, 19 Apr 2008 18:25:29 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17429 DRock, you hit it right on the nail. "No-contact" is another word for "touch". You play at full speed, but tackles are considered made when you are being "touched" by a defender. One thing is for the media and Florio to make a stir on the "non-contact" issue in the trenches, where things can get rough and out of hand. But when we are talking skill position, these unfortunate injuries is just a part of being out there preparing for the season. DRock, you hit it right on the nail. “No-contact” is another word for “touch”. You play at full speed, but tackles are considered made when you are being “touched” by a defender.
One thing is for the media and Florio to make a stir on the “non-contact” issue in the trenches, where things can get rough and out of hand. But when we are talking skill position, these unfortunate injuries is just a part of being out there preparing for the season.

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]]> By: Obidan http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17428 Obidan Sat, 19 Apr 2008 18:20:25 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17428 I agree, DRock. Much too much of an outcry is made here about the sessions being "non-contact" every time an injury occurs. I agree, DRock. Much too much of an outcry is made here about the sessions being “non-contact” every time an injury occurs.

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]]> By: skaybaltimore http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17419 skaybaltimore Sat, 19 Apr 2008 17:13:29 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17419 Picking up on what DRock said, Barnes is one intense player. Who's to say he didn't just go a little too far? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cerDBOd_zlg (Wait for the replay to see the hit Barnes put on Rocca. A hit, btw, for which he was penalized.) It's really impossible to say whether it was the player himself, or the coaches responsible for the contact in this instance. Picking up on what DRock said, Barnes is one intense player. Who’s to say he didn’t just go a little too far?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cerDBOd_zlg

(Wait for the replay to see the hit Barnes put on Rocca. A hit, btw, for which he was penalized.)

It’s really impossible to say whether it was the player himself, or the coaches responsible for the contact in this instance.

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]]> By: DRock http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17405 DRock Sat, 19 Apr 2008 16:26:00 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17405 I played college ball and we ran "non-contact" drills all the time in the off season. It's just offense vs defense no equipment... but when the ball is in the air and you catch it with defenders around there will always be unwanted contact. He may have made a move, trying to keep it like a game situation and clipped the linebacker... it happens. If the league or union doesn't want it than they need to have guys not participate in the drills. But when you have 22 players on the field running through plays, there will always be contact and speaking from experience it's not because the coaches initiate it. I played college ball and we ran “non-contact” drills all the time in the off season. It’s just offense vs defense no equipment… but when the ball is in the air and you catch it with defenders around there will always be unwanted contact. He may have made a move, trying to keep it like a game situation and clipped the linebacker… it happens.
If the league or union doesn’t want it than they need to have guys not participate in the drills. But when you have 22 players on the field running through plays, there will always be contact and speaking from experience it’s not because the coaches initiate it.

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]]> By: mike quick http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17401 mike quick Sat, 19 Apr 2008 16:13:59 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17401 Yeah, because major knee injuries never happen without contact.... right. Mike should build an ark for all the crying about this subject. Yeah, because major knee injuries never happen without contact…. right.

Mike should build an ark for all the crying about this subject.

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]]> By: milehighmagic http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17399 milehighmagic Sat, 19 Apr 2008 16:03:05 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17399 Man, this really is an issue with you. Man, this really is an issue with you.

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]]> By: boleyn9 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17398 boleyn9 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:58:38 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17398 How about a player suing the NFL over such matters? Since the Union isn't doing anything, a player should. How about a player suing the NFL over such matters? Since the Union isn’t doing anything, a player should.

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]]> By: filbertkiwi71 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17397 filbertkiwi71 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:57:33 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17397 Is this really any surprise? If the Ravens are running a much tougher camp then they have in the past, then IMO, it isn't any surprise if and when injuries occur. All the union has to do is ask the player. Isn't that what the union is for, to be there for the players? Is this really any surprise?

If the Ravens are running a much tougher camp then they have in the past, then IMO, it isn’t any surprise if and when injuries occur.

All the union has to do is ask the player. Isn’t that what the union is for, to be there for the players?

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]]> By: kirbysfriend http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17394 kirbysfriend Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:41:44 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17394 Anybody can blow out their knee in a non-contact drill. This news doesn't sound like enough to indict the Ravens in violation on non-contact rules. Have you ever played football or another sport? If you're trying to avoid contact and step in an awkward direction and plant the wrong way, you can easily do some damage. I hate the Ravens but this could easily be legit. Anybody can blow out their knee in a non-contact drill. This news doesn’t sound like enough to indict the Ravens in violation on non-contact rules.

Have you ever played football or another sport? If you’re trying to avoid contact and step in an awkward direction and plant the wrong way, you can easily do some damage.

I hate the Ravens but this could easily be legit.

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]]> By: bofarr http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17393 bofarr Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:34:00 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17393 Seriously, have you ever witnessed even a shorts and helmets practice Florio? I appreciate the ongoing crusade to protect players in mini-camp and agree there have been/are/always will be abuses but to say that "...in a non-contact activity, not only should a player not awkwardly bump another player, he also shouldn’t have to make sudden movements that will cause his knee to buckle because he’s attempting to avoid contact..." seems to show a lack of awareness of what goes on in even the simplest football practice. Even going 1/2 or 1/4 speed, when there are 22 or even just 14 (7 on 7) guys running around collisions sometimes inevitably occur and certainly an injury could happen avoiding an accidental collision especially with players converging on a pass. While I support your position on this issue, we just don't know what the circumstances were when this happened. Seriously, have you ever witnessed even a shorts and helmets practice Florio? I appreciate the ongoing crusade to protect players in mini-camp and agree there have been/are/always will be abuses but to say that “…in a non-contact activity, not only should a player not awkwardly bump another player, he also shouldn’t have to make sudden movements that will cause his knee to buckle because he’s attempting to avoid contact…” seems to show a lack of awareness of what goes on in even the simplest football practice. Even going 1/2 or 1/4 speed, when there are 22 or even just 14 (7 on 7) guys running around collisions sometimes inevitably occur and certainly an injury could happen avoiding an accidental collision especially with players converging on a pass. While I support your position on this issue, we just don’t know what the circumstances were when this happened.

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]]> By: jagsfan http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17391 jagsfan Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:32:29 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17391 Since when does “no contact” mean no coverage? We have all seen players hurt knees just making cuts or landing without a defender present so let’s not jump to a conclusion that the union isn’t doing its job until the facts are presented. The ones here now are thin, to say the least. Since when does “no contact” mean no coverage? We have all seen players hurt knees just making cuts or landing without a defender present so let’s not jump to a conclusion that the union isn’t doing its job until the facts are presented. The ones here now are thin, to say the least.

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]]> By: Row_60 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17390 Row_60 Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:32:11 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17390 "Contact" when referring to football practice isn't intended to mean any touching. No one would say that handing off is barred because the quarterback makes contact with the running back, or snapping the ball because the quarterback makes fairly intimate contact with the center. Similarly, a pass coverage/receiving drill isn't a contact drill, even if there might be incidental contact. Teams may be abusing the non-contact rules, but I don't see this as an example of it. “Contact” when referring to football practice isn’t intended to mean any touching. No one would say that handing off is barred because the quarterback makes contact with the running back, or snapping the ball because the quarterback makes fairly intimate contact with the center. Similarly, a pass coverage/receiving drill isn’t a contact drill, even if there might be incidental contact. Teams may be abusing the non-contact rules, but I don’t see this as an example of it.

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]]> By: skaybaltimore http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17385 skaybaltimore Sat, 19 Apr 2008 15:11:51 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17385 Valid point. There's a difference between Camp Creampuff, and Camp Creamed. Valid point. There’s a difference between Camp Creampuff, and Camp Creamed.

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]]> By: Norseman http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17381 Norseman Sat, 19 Apr 2008 14:58:41 +0000 http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/04/19/ravens-sypniewski-suffers-serious-injury/#comment-17381 "We do not allow any contact in off-season workouts, " *wink-wink-nudge-nudge* says Gene Upshaw. (Apologies to Monty Python) “We do not allow any contact in off-season workouts, ” *wink-wink-nudge-nudge* says Gene Upshaw.

(Apologies to Monty Python)

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